娇色导航

? Cathy O'Sullivan?

Welcome to 娇色导航leadership Live New Zealand. I'm Cathy O'Sullivan, Editorial Director in ANZ for Foundry. On today's episode, I'm delighted to be joined by Kirti Desai who is GM for Digital, Data and Technology at ProCare. Kia ora Kirti, welcome to the podcast. Thanks for being with us today.

? Kirti Desai? Hi Cathy.

Thank you for having me. ? Cathy O'Sullivan?

Great to have you. And listen, I'd love to hear about your career to date. How did you get your start in IT and what have been some of your career milestones? ? Kirti Desai?

So I guess I've always had a bit of a passion for using technology and how it can speed up processes, and empower people to do things differently or faster.

My journey into technology was actually through product development, and management in financial services in the UK, where I've worked for over 15 years. And I built the bulk of buying experience and transferable skills really from doing those roles.

So financial services will be disrupted by FinTech and digital banking when was taken off when I graduated.

And there was a real move towards using technology to improve and empower customer experience, reduce costs, and manual work, as well as being able to get data, better data and better reporting our systems.

I back then I worked for Alliance Leicester, which is now Santander, do product management for mortgages, investments, insurances, and then went on to kind of direct marketing and looking at looking at all of their advertising for digital channels.

So that was kind of a real tip first taste for me of digital and technology. And as well as an organization that was going through quite a lot of transformation at that time.

So that was a real move towards like digital banking back then, which is a completely different world today. But that was kind of those first steps in I then went to work for Egg. I'm not sure if you know what Egg is.

But Egg was the UK first Internet bank. And I worked for them for a couple of years, just before moving out to New Zealand. And my role there was really looking at new platforms looking at new technologies.

So at the time, I was looking at contactless payments, and payments that we would have in the future and what would the future look like? So I then moved over to New Zealand and have worked in across many different sectors.

So I've worked in banking payments, real estate, and now in healthcare, so focusing on digital transformation of businesses by focusing on customers needs and pain points. So not necessarily focusing on the technology that makes sense, but more kind of looking outward. So looking at actually that customer experience.

? Cathy O'Sullivan?

So now you're the GM of Digital, Data and Technology at ProCare. So can you give us an overview of the organisation, its purpose and what you and the team look after there? ? Kirti Desai? Oh, absolutely.

So ProCare is New Zealand's largest primary health organization and represents a network of general practices who provide care to more than 830,000 people across Auckland and Northland. Our purpose is all about uplifting the health and well being of the people of New Zealand.

So we have the largest Pacific and South Asian populations enrolled in general practice and the largest Māori population in Auckland. So ProCare delivers a number of health and wellbeing services. Some of these include clinical support services for our 174 member practices.

Our Fresh Minds business provides mental health and wellbeing services. Care HQ offers virtual and telehealth services and Ready Steady Quit supports people who want to stop smoking.

So my team is made up of a mix of of lots of different skill sets from data engineers, analysts, project managers, BAs, testers, developers and third parties who support us. So the team's responsibility is kind of responsible for a number of different areas.

But our kind of key is to really support the services that we offer across our business. We manage the business both to drive kind of population health outcomes.

And we do that through providing better data reporting and insights not just internally and to members, but also Te Whatu Ora [Health New Zealand] and external organizations that might might require the aggregated data to be able to see trends.

We manage all of the systems, the infrastructure, digital channels, cybersecurity, strategic project delivery and prioritization across the business. So it's quite a broad kind of skill set across the team. ? Cathy O'Sullivan?

So quite a diverse range of things that you and the team look after there. So how do you ensure then, Kirti, that the IT initiatives that you're implementing that they align with those overall strategic goals and the mission of ProCare. ? Kirti Desai?

Well, so the digital strategy is aligned up quite directly to our company's strategy. And I do that pretty much at the start of the year.

So, you know, when we're going into planning at the end of the financial year, we kind of really make sure that we're future focused on what what is it that we're gonna be working on in the coming two to three years?

What does that look like from an overall company perspective? And then where is the technology? So when I was saying to it's an enabler to me? Absolutely. It is about okay, if that's where the business and our customers are moving to?

So if that's what the needs of our not just our patients, but our members as well, if that's where the direction is, then actually, how do we utilize the technology that we have today?

And what will we need in the future to enable that, and that really drives a lot of the digital strategy for me, in terms of where we take it.

I work across our ELT, to kind of make sure that we capture a lot of those business requirements, but also the needs of understanding our customer at the end.

So that we can make sure that the strategy is aligned to to not just, you know, everybody what everybody was wishlist is, but actually our strategic goals, as well as our digital strategy that is, is kind of an enabler to embed that.

And then making sure that everybody understands it.

So communication at different staff of barons, making sure that my team fully understands how they fit into that picture, and how that lines back up, and then making sure that they can work across the business to embed it, and so that everybody's kind of lined up to working in the same direction.

? Cathy O'Sullivan?

And what's your approach, then, with emerging technologies, you know that there's a lot of noise at the moment around things like aI IoT automation, what's your approach when it comes to innovation within your IT departments. ? Kirti Desai?

So for our team, and actually, across the business, I have been public kind of decentralizing a little bit of the innovation, because I don't think it should just come from our team, I strongly at the moment can see that there's a lot of people that want to use, like generative Ai Chi Beatty, people want to use AI in different ways.

And I think it's important to kind of have that a little bit decentralized. So we encourage the team to learn and test new technologies or ideas. So I encourage my team, but also, I know that other parts of the business are also wanting to test new things.

So we've put a number of governance frameworks in place where, you know, that allows people to understand what they can and cannot do, we do a bit of a scooter review with the Lewbert alongside them.

So alongside my team, we have a process where anybody in the organization can come with an idea.

It's reviewed by peers from across the organization, to ensure that it aligns to solving patient or business problems aligns to our strategy, making sure that nobody else is already working on it, or has already kind of developed something in that space, we then encourage a bit of a proof of concept approach.

So that test and learn, let's see if it works, let's see what we can do to refine it, what do we need to do to maybe make it better, this also means that we kind of contested in a much smaller environment, rather than, you know, blanketly kind of mulching something big out there.

It means that people learn from it, it also means that we can get that collaboration across the teams. And also, we can make sure that we've understood the problems we were trying to solve to. So that's one of that test and learn approach. ? Cathy O'Sullivan?

That's wonderful and great that you have that collaborative approach, and that you are looking to include the rest of the organization and innovation as well. But look, you know, we there's that need for cutting edge technology and keeping up with emerging technologies.

But then also you've got your legacy system. So how do you balance that need with you know, the future focus on what's coming down the line and the importance of that maintaining those existing IT infrastructure and systems? ? Kirti Desai? Absolutely.

You know, that is actually one of the biggest challenges. I think that most people most organizations are facing, and I think in New Zealand, and probably globally, people have been going through digital transformation for a number of years in healthcare in particular.

I would say it's a little bit behind. So Financial Services has been going through this for a very long time. And they've been disrupted multiple times. In I guess, in healthcare is really only really started to be disrupted in potentially the last five, five years.

COVID was a real big catalyst of people starting to think about oh my god, I've got, you know, loads of legacy systems and we need to be able to run and we need to be able to do things.

There's a lot of change coming not just internal but also from, you know, government reforms. So for us, the way that I've really approached it. So prepare has been around looking at our digital transformation strategy and dividing it into three key areas.

So foundational being the first one, this is really looking at things that, you know, this can be some of your legacy systems or things that you must have in your organization.

So for us, that's like our modern data platform, or our CRM, these are things that you absolutely need to kind of do think of it a bit like building a house, you wouldn't, you wouldn't start digging up stuff or building an extension on the house, if you didn't have the foundations safe.

So that concrete laid and making sure that you know, you're going to build on something that's going to last a long time. And that's the same in technology. For me, it's exactly the same kind of concept.

So making sure that we've got those foundational things that we absolutely need to make sure that everything that we build on top of it, will, will be there, and it will last and it will be future focused. The next one for me is enable.

So this is around what do we need to enable the business to make sure that we can offer provide those, the business with services or empower them to be able to utilize it.

So in this space, we, I would say for us appropriate, it's things like our websites, our members portal, the things that our customers and our businesses like us our business areas are using.

And this really enables them to, to do the things that they want to do and do their work. So to do their day to day or to kind of be able to manage the way that the work grows. So that's the last one for me.

So this is kind of the last pillar around. Alright, so what do we need to grow our business? What do we need to make sure that, you know, we're kind of always focused on our next new thing as well. So new solutions, product ideas to grow our business.

So those kind of the three areas is how I really approach our strategy in terms of making sure that we don't forget about the things that we actually need to replace or like our legacy systems that might come next warranty, making sure that we're still got a bit of a focus around the things that can enable the business to move forward, and for our customers and our business to be able to do the day to day, and then also growth.

So what is the things that might be coming up the new solutions, the new product ideas, to make sure that we're also focused on where we want to go? ? Cathy O'Sullivan?

Now, cybersecurity is a hot topic in the industry. And for CIOs more than anyone I know, it's one of the top priorities for for most CIOs in this region.

So what role do you think cybersecurity plays in healthcare IT and you know, for you i pro care, how do you ensure, you know, the security around and privacy of patient data?

You know, it's certainly been an area that there's been a lot of news stories about in recent times. So how do you ensure that the safety of your data? ? Kirti Desai?

Oh, absolutely, I think in healthcare at the moment, and it has been a growing trend for sure. Cybersecurity is absolutely crucial in healthcare, as it is in financial services in most sectors.

Now, I don't actually think there's a sector that can get away with not being aware or having cybersecurity some kind of processes or governance or, or something in place right now.

So what we've done is we've got a data governance structures, very clear governance processes in place, we've got policies, we've partnered with cybersecurity company to support us in managing security across all of our systems. We also review those processes and policies.

And then we also get somebody an external company to independently review this. So review what we're doing, review how we're using systems making sure that our data is safe, and it's secure.

And having that independent assessment ensures that we can stay up to date, you know, is there anything else that we should be doing, making sure that we're monitoring it and reviewing it on a regular basis makes a big difference. As part of our kind of cybersecurity.

We do manage, we manage things on a regular basis.

But our security partner also provides us with regular reporting on a monthly basis, we have a sit down capture, we do regular workshops, where we'll look at what else is happening in the cybersecurity world what what is happening outside of poker that could impact us, and what else should we be aware of?

So it's trying to make sure that you stay up to date with all the new stuff. There's a lot happening in cybersecurity at the moment, especially with AI. I think that's become a bit of a game changer.

And as much as it's going to do lots of positive things. It's also going to enable, unfortunately, so enable a lot of phishing attacks and other things that will affect all organizations cybersecurity controls. ? Cathy O'Sullivan?

Yeah, it's an absolute minefields be very interesting over the next few years to see how that plays out. So, look, you know, cybersecurity as a challenge. You spoke earlier about legacy systems being a challenge.

Are there any other challenges that you can think of, particularly in the healthcare sector that IT leaders face? And how do you address them? ? Kirti Desai?

Right now, for it, there is a lot, especially in for in the healthcare space, there's a lot of change in the sector at the moment with government changes and reforms coming in.

We're all dealing with like a systems across healthcare, and also trying to embrace the new technology that's coming out. So kind of trying to find that balance between the two funding, I think, you know, funding and the cost increases across technology have definitely impacted.

All organizations that I've been talking to, a lot of my colleagues across different healthcare organizations are saying exactly the same thing, you know, our costs went up at a time where we've got so many changes and systems and projects on the go.

So you know, that's, that's a real hard Act, to juggle. To be fair, it's also a really exciting time, though, as we get an opportunity to think about how we can do things differently.

Hopefully, instead of just kind of going through the stages of transformation, we might actually be able to leap into the future a little bit, there's a lot of things happening overseas, that we could take advantage of or, or learn from others experiences that you know, could help us here in the healthcare sector in New Zealand do things a little bit differently.

My approach at the moment has definitely been around having a really clear two year strategy, and allowing room for that to pivot and change as needed.

So it's an evolving strategy, you know, I don't really believe in having a structure that stays stale, it's got to be reviewed, you've got to use it, it's got to be adaptable, and evolve.

If the organization changes direction, or if something external happens, that means that you have to do something a little bit differently, or there's brand new technology that you think actually that's a better solution, and would provide us better future proofing, then, you know, absolutely, your strategy should be something that is evolved, it's reviewed, it's used across the organization.

So definitely making sure that the strategy has got room to do that. And so it's not a lockdown approach, because things are changing very, very fast in the sector. ? Cathy O'Sullivan?

So you're adapting your strategy, you know, you're dealing with such a diverse range of stakeholders in the wider business, how do you then bridge that gap between your technical it language and the understanding of those non technical stakeholders? What kind of communication strategies do you use?

? Kirti Desai?

Well, I actually think my biggest strength comes from the fact that I've come from such a broad business background. So having worked in sales, marketing, product management, digital, you know, I think that really makes quite a big difference.

Because I can ask questions, I can relate back my understanding to the business, I actually usually, you know, have come from some of their roles, some of the needs that they're talking about. So I call with that probably slightly different lens from a customer or business problem lens.

So I think I can rely back on some of those things. If I'm unsure, I definitely use questioning as a bit of a technique to make sure that I've understood things. Secondly, relaying it back. So if I've misunderstood something, at least, then somebody will correct me.

And I'm not overly technical, I understand systems architecture and technology can communicate with technical people.

But I guess I've learned over time to be that bridge between the business's needs and then being able to kind of work with my team and bring things back and forth, to make sure that things line up, quite like rather than it just being from a technology perspective that things actually do line up.

? Cathy O'Sullivan?

And then I'm sure you work with a number of partners and technology partners. What do you look for when you're going out to market when you're choosing a technology partner? What looks good from your perspective? ? Kirti Desai?

So you're right, actually, we worked with a number of different third parties from you know, managing our it down to come in cybersecurity stuff. So a big things for me really are around, I guess, Honesty and trust. So that's really important to me.

So having working with a partner that actually stays true to their strengths.

So it's important to me that they tell me they can't do something or that that's not their specialism, the area that they've focused on, and then providing me either way that other contexts if they think that there's Another company that would be better at that, because the worst thing that can happen is that you sign up with a partner, and they can't actually deliver what what you originally sat down and discussed, or they can only deliver part of it.

And then that really just erodes a lot of that credibility for me over time.

Because it's, it's usually built on honesty, trust, you know, information that you get from them, making sure that you, they understand your business, that they take the time to understand the challenges that you're facing, the organization is going through seeing how they can actually help help you versus trying to sell you a whole heap of stuff that you may or may not need, because they don't really understand your business model.

The me really doesn't really kind of say, to me, this is a parliament that I want to partner with, because they haven't taken the time to understand our organization, or the challenges and the priorities that we have.

But they're just trying to sell me a whole load of technology that, that I don't even need, in some instances, you know, so for me, it's like, take the time to build the relationship, take the time to understand us, so that we can actually create more of a partnership approach to kind of going on that journey rather than just buying something from a third party supplier.

? Cathy O'Sullivan?

Yeah, it comes through so much in the interviews I do at CIOs, are they sharing that pain, understanding the organization that they're approaching?

And the values are and what's actually important, rather than just the the cold, hard sales pitch on, we have the stuff, let us sell it to you. And look closer to you, you spoke earlier about how you collaborate with the wider business in terms of that innovation piece.

But when it comes to your own IT team? I mean, what kind of strategies do you have for that, fostering that collaboration, and, and, you know, making them as productive as possible. ? Kirti Desai?

I'm probably biased, but you know, I've got a really great team.

And I really encourage the team to share, you know, any ideas that they have, working with the business and even internally, you know, if you've got an idea, let's share it, let's talk about it, raise questions or concerns, if you think that something, we're going about something in the wrong way that absolutely feel that you can, you can share all of those insights.

So one of the things when I hire people, and when they join our team, and I tell them consistently is around, we've hired you for your skills and your experience, so please don't leave them at the door.

You know, I want a collaborative team that comes together that wants to be there, but also brings their whole south through that door every single day, you know, and brings their ideas brings the ways of working that they might have learned from other organization.

And I think we use agile kind of methodologies as a way to collaborate not just the cost of the team, but also with the business so that we're constantly not becoming this isolated IT team but also having a team that works with the business and brings things back and forth.

So it's kind of that CO design, how do we do it together. And actually getting the technical team to also understand the business and vice versa.

So that also opens that doorway of a two way ongoing collaborative approach of not just having a team that's kind of just looking inwards, but really looking outwards, and bringing that back and forth.

So that we can actually create quite a good collaborative culture, not just within the team, but also broader than across the business. So ? Cathy O'Sullivan?

then, what do you think around, you know, ways to attract more people from a variety of backgrounds into it? Are there any practical things that you can think can be done to ensure that we have, you know, minds of all kinds and technology and different approaches?

? Kirti Desai?

I do, I think, you know, I think employers do look at some of the roles and think, what skills are transferable? Rather than, you know, I've seen a lot of jadis, where it's just full of all this technical stuff that people want.

But there's actually lots of people that work in lots of different sectors that could add value into technology, I think, especially into the IT teams, because I think in the future more non technical people will be 90 Does, everyone's roles are already starting to change.

And most of those roles now have an element of technology already in them. So if you're a user of technology, then you will already have ideas on what you think it would, you know, what could be done better?

How could it solve a different problem or what how could it benefit customers in a different way?

Then this is where some of those people are now moving into product owner roles because they don't necessarily have to be technical, traditional IT roles, these are kind of all people that bring that business, understanding, they have a passionate understanding of technology, and also can then relay that back, and then focus on the outcome.

So then that allows the rest of the team to think about the solutions.

So I think, you know, there's a role for employers around, not just looking for traditional, you know, kind of, these are the five years experience of, you know, being a JavaScript writer, or whatever it is that you're looking for.

But also looking at those other different softer skills, that are transferable skills around whether it's project management or, you know, product development, or whatever it is, even in marketing, you know, there's gonna be loads of marketing automation type roles, where people will be utilizing technology, because actually, their roles are going to be become so ingrained in the way that technology works, that you won't be able to do nobody's role will be without an element of technology, if that makes sense.

? Cathy O'Sullivan? Yeah, absolutely.

And even more so as as you know, advances in AI, we're seeing that importance of the softer skills, the human skills as well in these roles. So what advice would you give to someone who was aspiring to be a 娇色导航or a senior IT leader? ? Kirti Desai?

I'd say I wanted to be in, in technology and digital. And I remember having a mentor.

So you know, I would say to you, if it is an area, you definitely want to go into whether you already in the technology path, or whether you're working in a role that's outside of the digital or the technology team. Absolutely.

You know, go and reach out to somebody and ask them if they would be willing to be a mentor to you, you know, ask them questions about how they got into it. What is it that they liked about it, about that role?

And what does what does that role need to have? I think when I look back, that's, that's definitely what I did. You know, and don't worry if you don't have all of the answers, as technology is changing, and the role is evolving all the time anyway.

So you don't necessarily need to have all of the answers and know everything. I don't even think you really need to be technical, I think you just need to have transferable skills, be keen to learn, ask questions.

And and then, you know, once you get into those roles, then trust that your team will do a good job, you know, you hire the right people.

And usually people, you know, I always hire for where my gaps are, too, you know, because that's actually what leadership looks like. It's not having loads of people that are exactly the same issue.

It's actually say, you know, what do we need, what is the capability we need, and therefore hiring for those capabilities, skills.

And if your first time trying to get into to being a CIO, then look, even looking at some of those job descriptions, I remember looking at some of them way back, and thinking, I'm not sure I've got some of these skills.

So thinking about the roles that you then take in between to help you develop some of the skills or getting some of that exposure and experience so that you wouldn't get to that level, you will actually feel like, oh, actually do know how to do this, and there's still a gap.

And they'll still be things that you'll need to learn, but at least you'll be going at it from an avenue of I did, I do have an idea about what the job entails, because that also helps you to in some way that you're going to want to do it.

Because I think you know, the worst thing you can do is think that's a role, you really want to get there and you don't really enjoy it. So being really clear about you know, your, your drivers, for what, what you want to get out of that role.

But also, I think for me, I was really passionate about making a difference. And that's a really big driver for me moving into healthcare as well. Because, you know, I knew that I loved doing all the digital transformation stuff.

And I knew that I really wanted to make a difference in the sector that I thought I could make a really empowering difference to was healthcare.

And so I think COVID really kind of highlighted that for a lot of people in terms of making them think about where they want to be. And definitely for me, COVID highlighted to me that I really wanted to move into healthcare, I wanted to make a difference.

And I wanted to use my skills and experience to drive that.

So I think if I was in any advice I would give an aspiring 娇色导航now is be true to who you were, where you want to be and your values and the things that are important to you, because it's a tough role.

And you do need to dig deep sometimes to make sure that you are clear about why you're doing it. Because you're gonna need some of that passion to get you through when it is challenging. Yeah, ? Cathy O'Sullivan? Very well said.

And finally, then Kirti, what's important to you in the months ahead, any exciting initiatives in the pipeline? ? Kirti Desai?

Yeah, we have a number of really exciting projects on the go at the moment, which we'll be completing, and they align up to Well strategy. So we're in the middle of kind of planning for next year. So I'm excited about that.

But this year, we're keen now we're really close to completing our modern data platform, which will become our data engine, and enabling self service analytics platform to empower both in the business, our internal business units, users, as well as our members.

So I think that, you know, that's a really exciting kind of conclusion to a big project we've worked on.

And we're also working with our partners on a new platform moment for our mental health business, which really future proofs, I guess, poker in the mental health space as we move forward.

It's going to be a huge enabler for our clinicians, and also for the clients that use our services.

So I think, you know, there's, it's a really exciting time at the moment, I think there's a lot of changes happening not not just at poker, but I think in healthcare has changed in general.

And I think you know, the future, it's as much as it's going to be a bit of a rocky road.

And it will also be a really exciting time right now, because there'll be a lot of new initiatives and new ways of doing things and I think it's quite an exciting, exciting journey that we're on. ? Cathy O'Sullivan?

Well, I look forward to catching up with you again with when some of these projects come to fruition. Kirti Desai, GM for Digital, Data and Technology at ProCare, thank you so much for joining us today.